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Quote 303
Righteous John, Wonderworker of Kronstadt
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Quote 303 - Форум
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Quote 303
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| readeralexey | Дата: Воскресенье, 27.10.2024, 00:40 | Сообщение # 1 |
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| That which is around me or upon me does not constitute myself; even my flesh, with which I am clothed, and of which I consist, as a portion of my earthly being, does not constitute my real self.
Righteous John, Wonderworker of Kronstadt
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| dawa2311 | Дата: Воскресенье, 27.10.2024, 19:04 | Сообщение # 2 |
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| That which is around me or upon me does not constitute myself; even my flesh, with which I am clothed and of which I consist, as a portion of my earthly being, does not constitute my real self. This is the phrase which was said by saint John of Kronshtadt. I partly agree with this point of view and I would like to express mine.
On the one hand, our soul is more important than our body because when we will pass away and go to the Kindom of God we'll not have bodies any more. We will have only souls. We won't have our jobs, hobbies, highplaces etc.
There will be only our real self. Only our real self will stand before God. Our bodies are temporal but our souls are eternal.
However, it doesn't mean that we shouldn't take care of our body. If we don't take care of our body it is also a kind of a sign or disrespect to God. There is even a service devoted to the body. "We find love, this caring, this reverent attitude towards the body in Orthodoxy; and this is reflected in an amazing way in the funeral service. We surround this body with love and attention; this body is the center of the funeral service for the deceased; not only the soul, but also the body. And indeed, if you think about it: there is nothing in human experience, not only earthly, but also heavenly, that would not reach us through our body." (Metropolitan Antony of Sourozh)
In conclusion, I should say that we have to take care of our soul and body, these both things are important. The only difference is that the body can be left but the soul can not.
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Дарья Ткачёва
Сообщение отредактировал dawa2311 - Суббота, 21.12.2024, 17:33 |
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| tsumskaa30 | Дата: Понедельник, 28.10.2024, 16:46 | Сообщение # 3 |
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| It is evident that it is our soul that is the centre of our spiritual life. Human soul is immortal, it is absolutely unique. Even if our bodies seem to be beautiful, pleasant to the eye and well-tended, our soul may be filled with iniquity. All our sins come from the soul as Christ said: “For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man” (Mth. 15:19-20). Thus, our soul is accountable for all the actions, it will be judged and, hopefully, saved.
In contrast, many images in hymnography depict bodies as something mortal, temporal and defiled. However, we should remember that both our soul and our body will rise from the death dead when Christ comes in the end. Our bodies were also created by the Lord and we shouldn’t think of it them as something negative. Of course, they don’t reflect the fullness of our real selves, but they are a significant part of our personality.
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Сообщение отредактировал readeralexey - Четверг, 19.12.2024, 17:16 |
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| abalakinan27 | Дата: Понедельник, 11.11.2024, 20:09 | Сообщение # 4 |
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| I really appreciate thoughts of Righteous John, Wonderworker of Kronstadt. I would like to bear in mind this idea as a reminder that I am what I produce, not the physical and outer stuff. The soul is more deeper, more meaningful than the body, bit but unfortunately we are all prone to forgetting it. That's why we, as Christians, should take care more of our soul rather than our appearance:
18 “Are you so dull?” he asked. “Don’t you see that nothing that enters a person from the outside can defile them? 19 For it doesn’t go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body.” (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)
20 He went on: “What comes out of a person is what defiles them. 21 For it is from within, out of a person’s heart, that evil thoughts come—sexual immorality, theft, murder, 22 adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly. 23 All these evils come from inside and defile a person.” (Mark 7:18-23)
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Сообщение отредактировал readeralexey - Четверг, 19.12.2024, 17:20 |
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| katyadorniak | Дата: Среда, 20.11.2024, 20:26 | Сообщение # 5 |
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| I agree with righteous John. Our true identity is something more than our appearance, possessions, or even our physical body. Although we live in the world and interact with it through our bodies, they do not fully reflect our essence on a deeper level. Our true self is inside, beyond the material, encompassing our soul, thoughts and inner experience. Realizing that our essence is not limited to the visible or tangible, we can focus on improving our inner life and spiritual growth, rather than getting lost in external visibility. This point of view helps us to look for meaning beyond the physical and realize our spiritual identity. However, taking care of our "vessel for the soul" is also necessary. This shows how much we appreciate the gift of our Creator.
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EkaterinaDolzhenkova
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| lolosipovanika | Дата: Пятница, 29.11.2024, 01:05 | Сообщение # 6 |
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| The point of the quote is that a human is not his/her body. We feel not only physical feelings, but also emotions, love, sorrow. They're some things that are not material, because of them we have poems, films, books and other arts. They are all about the way we can express something that is untouchable, something that is hiding deeply in our hearts.
In other words, I want to emphasize that I agree with the quote's statement: flesh doesn't constitute the whole person. When you truly think of someone as a person, you don't think about his/her appearance, but concentrate on his/her characteristics, feelings and soul.
To sum up, I agree that a human is not only about an earthly being, it's more about our spiritual part, about which we shouldn't forget.
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| lisaswan001 | Дата: Пятница, 29.11.2024, 21:10 | Сообщение # 7 |
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| These words from Righteous John, Wonderworker of Kronstadt reminded me of a Lewis quote that hangs on the wall of my room: “You do not have a soul. You are a soul. You have a body”. And it is true - the body is only a temporary shell, existing with us during our earthly life and only during it. I also like a poem by a contemporary poet where our body is compared to a spacesuit:
«…в скафандре тесно, он сильно ограничивает возможности перемещения, приходит с годами в негодность, доставляет массу хлопот - совершенно неясно, что они все так рыдали над твоим скафандром и целовали в шлем; как будто он когда-то что-то действительно определял в том, кем ты являешься и для чего пришёл…» (у стихотворение нет характерной формы, поэтому оно написано сплошным текстом)
In general, our life often becomes the subject of comparisons in literature and in life in general, I remember my dad's speech at the funeral of his friend. My dad compared life to a terminal at the airport, where everyone is waiting for their flight and doesn't know when they will be called. I don't remember the exact details, but as a child I was deeply struck by this idea; later, I often noticed this concept in modern literature.
If we go back to the meaning of the quote, I completely agree with it. The main thing in us is the soul, no matter how much we concentrate on our style, body and all earthly things, all of it will disappear after death. Therefore, throughout our lives we must improve it, not our outer shell.
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Сообщение отредактировал lisaswan001 - Четверг, 05.12.2024, 23:40 |
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| sodrozdova | Дата: Воскресенье, 01.12.2024, 13:46 | Сообщение # 8 |
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| I find this quotation to be a bit controversial. A person is a whole that cannot be divided into pieces, but we do contain many different parts. We can be seen as a whole if we look at just one aspect of ourselves. For instance, at university, I act in one way, but later, with my mother, I will be a different person. We are individuals and we change how we act depending on the situation, so it is easier for others to understand us. This does not mean that we are not true to ourselves. All these different behaviors are a part of our nature and help to shape our personality.
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| veronikachernykh15 | Дата: Воскресенье, 01.12.2024, 21:59 | Сообщение # 9 |
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| Metropolitan Anthony of Sourozh says, "We must see ourselves as the material that God has placed in our hands, and from which we can create a work of art that will become part of the realm of harmony, beauty, truth, and life. In this sense, we need to have the same focus and clarity of vision as an artist."
Therefore, we should see our bodies as a gift from God. This is what allows us to live on Earth. We must take care of our bodies: feed them, give them rest so they can work. But at the same time, our bodies are also a reflection of our sins. As artists, we can make something beautiful out of what God has given us, or we can ruin it. This goes for both our souls and our bodies. Both can become our reflections of the struggle against passions.
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Сообщение отредактировал veronikachernykh15 - Воскресенье, 01.12.2024, 21:59 |
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| readeralexey | Дата: Вторник, 03.12.2024, 15:12 | Сообщение # 10 |
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| Friends, this is indeed a rather controversial quote (in the part about the body). We are not spirits imprisoned in matter and waiting to be released through death (as platonists and other pagan philosophers think) - but integral beings consisting of both spirit and matter. The importance of the body can not be overestimated. God became incarnate. Demons can not profit by Christ's death on the Cross because they have no body. We receive the Body and the Blood of Christ and unite with God thanks to our bodies. We "look forward to the resurrection of the dead" and after that - "the life of the age to come".
So, to what extent my body is "me" is a good question.
A thought-provoking video on the subject.
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| marie05052001 | Дата: Вторник, 10.12.2024, 16:32 | Сообщение # 11 |
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| I agree that the body doesn’t constitute the person’s real self. Character means much more. I can give examples of two great men, who were / are disabled: Lev Pontryagin (1908-1988) and Nick Vujicic (born 1982). Despite their disabilities, they could realise themselves in professions and create families.
Moreover, as Christians we believe that after the death of the body life doesn't end. It just begins.
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Сообщение отредактировал marie05052001 - Пятница, 20.12.2024, 17:32 |
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