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Quote 276
Venerable Ephraim the Syrian
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Quote 276 - Форум
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Quote 276
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| readeralexey | Дата: Среда, 18.10.2023, 12:22 | Сообщение # 1 |
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| If you want to conquer vainglory, love not praise, nor honor, nor fine clothes, nor precedence, nor favor; but on the contrary, cherish occasions when you are reprimanded and dishonored, when false charges are brought against you—and reproach yourself for being more sinful than any sinner.
Venerable Ephraim the Syrian
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| yarovaya02 | Дата: Среда, 25.10.2023, 07:38 | Сообщение # 2 |
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| “It is only necessary to remember that such self-knowledge comes not only with the help of our own compulsion, but also, especially, with the assistance of Divine grace. As a rule, this is a gradual spiritual change, and not some kind of lightning discovery and instantaneous rebirth of a person. If there were no God's grace comforting and strengthening a person, no one would be able to withstand this terrible sight — their infinite sinfulness, the hell that the ascetic sees in his soul”
[Is this a quotation? What is the source?]
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| veronikachernykh15 | Дата: Среда, 25.10.2023, 23:09 | Сообщение # 3 |
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| I agree with the quote that this can partly help fighting against vanity. Self-deprecation and criticism can help with vainglory, but where to find the line between healthy self-criticism and belittling yourself so much that it begins to harm others?
Such intense self-hatred can only lead to despondency and helplessness. It is especially
difficult to resist when you feel that such behavior bears fruit, meekness and humility really help to focus on prayer and lead a more pious lifestyle, but the temptation arises at this moment.
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Сообщение отредактировал veronikachernykh15 - Суббота, 23.12.2023, 00:23 |
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| sodrozdova | Дата: Среда, 25.10.2023, 23:46 | Сообщение # 4 |
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| I believe that nowadays people need rest from all this hate in the Internet. People have become angrier and sometimes it is very hard to manage all the bad treatment you can receive. I think it is necessary not to be too proud of yourself. That leads people to temptations.
But saying good words to other people should help them, but not humiliate them. You always have to be careful what you receive and what you give to others. The best way to behave is to stay calm while hearing all good and bad opinions about yourself, not being either too pleased or too depressed.
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Сообщение отредактировал sodrozdova - Суббота, 23.12.2023, 12:21 |
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| marichernaya911 | Дата: Четверг, 26.10.2023, 16:47 | Сообщение # 5 |
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| So many people, hearing things like that, feel depressed or even offended. It is impossible for a secular person to think of themselves as of worse than the worst criminal, to think of themselves as of the last sinner.
To tell the truth, even for Christians this idea seems mostly unacceptable. That is something we'd better keep silence about. When priests in sermons take risk to speak of it, they are usually being condemned as offending people listening. We tend to think of ourselves as of good and kind people. However, the best people of this world, the saints, thought of themselves this humble way till their death, despite the fact of explicit holiness and miracles. So, that is the way to holiness for us also.
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Сообщение отредактировал marichernaya911 - Четверг, 14.12.2023, 22:10 |
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| tsvioletta17 | Дата: Четверг, 26.10.2023, 18:37 | Сообщение # 6 |
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| I find this quote from Venerable Ephrem the Syrian too radical. Perhaps it is suitable for monks in monasteries if taken literally. I believe that for a person living in the secular world, this quote has the meaning that one should not get attached to things, one should not adore luxuries, one should listen to criticism and correct one's mistakes, humble oneself, repent and in general one should not make things the meaning of life. And, as always, to remember your sinfulness.
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Сообщение отредактировал tsvioletta17 - Четверг, 14.12.2023, 00:17 |
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| lolosipovanika | Дата: Среда, 01.11.2023, 21:09 | Сообщение # 7 |
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| I think, Venerable Ephraim the Syrian means humility, as it is the main virtue of Christianity. We must forgive all our enemies and let every grievance go away from us, even if false charges are brought against us. And neither honor, nor fine clothes, nor precedence would make us closer to God, because we cannot take it with us to the Heavens, it's all from this world. We must take an example from Christ, because he is the best example of humility for every Christian. And only then we will be closer to the Heavenly Kingdom.
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Сообщение отредактировал lolosipovanika - Суббота, 23.12.2023, 23:07 |
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| amasaltseva | Дата: Вторник, 07.11.2023, 10:30 | Сообщение # 8 |
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| It seems only by conquering vainglory we may achieve true humility and get a little closer to God. How simple it is to get proud when being praised, how hard it is to be humble when being honored. Truth be told, I don’t find praising someone sinful, and it seems to me that you shouldn't always flee that as it is natural. The problem is that it may be tempting and dangerous for our souls. That’s why we should as well accept the moments of reprimands given to us. Not to feel bad but to acknowledge our sinful nature. These things are greatly different, I guess.
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Сообщение отредактировал amasaltseva - Четверг, 14.12.2023, 17:04 |
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| ulyana_kazakova | Дата: Понедельник, 20.11.2023, 16:03 | Сообщение # 9 |
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| I don't like these words. I do not think that a man should humiliate himself and consider himself the worst of sinners, and only then he will overcome vanity.
The situation can turn upside down, because the following can happen: A man decides that he must conquer vainglory. He loves neither praise nor honour, nor beautiful clothes, nor superiority, nor favour, but rather cherishes the occasions when he is reviled and dishonoured, when false accusations are made against him, and reproaches himself that he is more sinful than any sinner. And then that man will think: I am the strongest, because I think I am the most sinful of all men, I am the humblest because they say mean things to my face and I bear it. Would he then overcome vanity? I don't think so. I picture this man as Al Pacino as John Milton in The Devil's Advocate when he says: "Vanity is definitely my favourite sin"))
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Сообщение отредактировал ulyana_kazakova - Среда, 13.12.2023, 23:27 |
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| sasavasl15 | Дата: Суббота, 09.12.2023, 19:53 | Сообщение # 10 |
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| For me, this quote and this way of fighting is not quite suitable. This path can easily lead to obsession with your humiliation. Your whole life will be reduced to searching for those who will humiliate and dishonor you. And it is very easy to be proud of the fact that you are the most sinful of all sinners. It is much more difficult to find a middle ground in life, where there will be a place for self-love as God's creation, but also for humility as a sinner.
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Сообщение отредактировал sasavasl15 - Четверг, 14.12.2023, 19:36 |
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| lisaswan001 | Дата: Среда, 20.12.2023, 14:08 | Сообщение # 11 |
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| The quote by the Venerable Ephrem the Syrian offers a powerful approach to overcoming vainglory. It challenges the desire for external validation, calling people to find growth and virtue in moments of dishonour and criticism. This perspective is consistent with the Christian emphasis on humility as a virtue and the rejection of vanity. It echoes the universal struggle against the temptation of self-aggrandisement, encouraging self-examination and growth through humility. Practically, it encourages a reassessment of responses to criticism, emphasising the value of moral integrity and genuine self-improvement. This quote offers a practical approach to navigating the complexities of the human ego and seeking spiritual maturity.
Still, I have to mention that I find this quote too radical. There must be boundaries in everything: in self-love and self-criticism. It is our responsibility not to go to either extreme. Unfortunately, experience has shown that people who are too critical of themselves become wicked because they see their own sins in other people. It is important to recognise our imperfections and work on them, but there is no point in hating ourselves, for we are all beloved children of Christ.
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Сообщение отредактировал lisaswan001 - Воскресенье, 24.12.2023, 20:33 |
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| salomiagudova | Дата: Пятница, 22.12.2023, 15:38 | Сообщение # 12 |
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| I completely agree with Venerable Ephraim the Syrian. Among other things, vainglory feeds upon praise because it can make you feel like you actually deserve this praise because of what you have done, said, thought of or maybe even worn and therefore you are better than those who have not done, said, thought of or even worn something. Praise and honour are closely connected because, as it seems to me, where there is much praise, there is honour near at hand as well, and both are prone to make you feel “big.” And precedence and favour come with honour and only make you more conceited.
So, to conquer vainglory we must avoid praise and honour and precedence and favour and everything that leads to them such as fine clothes. Instead, we must find humility in ourselves because only with humility can we hope to become worthy of the Kingdom of Heaven. And to find humility, we must always remember that we can always be better.
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Сообщение отредактировал salomiagudova - Среда, 27.12.2023, 13:53 |
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| alekssander-com29 | Дата: Пятница, 22.12.2023, 20:23 | Сообщение # 13 |
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| As it seems to me with this quote Venerable Ephraim the Syrian provides a spiritual guide for fighting vainglory. In the rich and long-lasting tradition of Orthodox spirituality, the struggle against vainglory holds a significant place. The root of it is found in Christ`s words during the Sermon on the Mount: «Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the Earth» (Matthew 5:5).
Instead of seeking praise, honor, fancy clothes, or special treatment, Venerable Ephraim suggests quite a radical different approach. He advises us to appreciate moments of criticism, dishonor, and false accusations. Additionally, he encourages us to be honest with ourselves, recognizing our own faults and sins more than we judge others.
And of course these are true and right words, which we should follow and tend to this ideal but it seems to me that people shouldn`t be so radical and go too far in their tendency to maximize everything, otherwise, humbling of the self might become self-hatred and destruction.
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Сообщение отредактировал alekssander-com29 - Вторник, 26.12.2023, 21:30 |
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| bondarenkodv7 | Дата: Суббота, 27.01.2024, 07:14 | Сообщение # 14 |
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| I share Venerable Ephraim’s opinion. In order to combat vainglory, you should avoid the circumstances that provoke it – praise, honor, favor. What you should seek instead are the circumstances that are humiliating (and so bring forth humility), such as dishonor, scolding, and false accusations, and consider yourself more sinful than any other sinner.
We can see similar themes in Venerable Ephraim’s famous prayer that is typically read during the Great Lent. In this prayer, he asks the Lord not to grant him a spirit of “love of power”, which often accompanies vainglory, and give to him a spirit of “humility, patience, and love”. In the final line of the prayer, he says, “O Lord and King, grant me to see my own faults”, which would be the first step in reproaching yourself for being sinful.
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Daniil Bondarenko
Сообщение отредактировал bondarenkodv7 - Суббота, 27.01.2024, 07:14 |
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